Baseball Toaster Screen Jam
Thursday Night Open Chat: January 11
2007-01-11 17:32
by Jon Weisman

Enjoy. Remember: no spoilers from upcoming episodes. I'll check in at my usual time.

For pregame pondering: Which current Thursday shows do you like, which do you dislike, which do you ignore?

Comments (129)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-01-11 17:43:54
1.   D4P
Like: Devine Design, House Hunters
Like (though not as much the past few seasons): Scrubs
Ignore: The Office and everything else
2007-01-11 18:51:35
2.   trainwreck
I watch the Office, but I am not a dedicated watcher like most here.

I watch Inside the UFC at 12:00. D4P, did you hear the rumor that UFC bought Pride? I am very skeptical right now.

2007-01-11 18:55:29
3.   D4P
No, I didn't hear that rumor. The way things are going, I guess I wouldn't be surprised.

I was hoping Randy would stay retired, but I always suspected he'd come back. I don't think he has any chance against Big Tim.

Do you listen to the Beatdown? Nick Diaz' interview was, well, memorable...

2007-01-11 19:03:38
4.   Bob Timmermann
I will dread the coming Thursdays when Pac-10 basketball games will compete against my favorite shows (Office, Scrubs, Ugly Betty, and Men in Trees).
2007-01-11 19:04:35
5.   trainwreck
I do not usually listen to those. Nick Diaz say something crazy or talking mad trash? I am so surprised.
2007-01-11 19:06:50
6.   Andrew Shimmin
We need to get Xeifrank to drop by and tell D4P and trainwreck that they aren't allowed to talk about their fancy fighting games at Screen Jam.
2007-01-11 19:06:59
7.   D4P
You should make a point to listen to it. It's crazy. They also talk to Jason MacDonald, with whom I've been impressed thus far.
2007-01-11 19:08:37
8.   D4P
Trying to get Xeifrank to visit Screen Jam is like trying to get Steve to visit Ontario.
2007-01-11 19:10:34
9.   Greg Brock
I watch Grey's Anatomy. There, I said it.
2007-01-11 19:11:15
10.   D4P
Greg's a female...? Wow.
2007-01-11 19:14:20
11.   Andrew Shimmin
Xei was by at least once:

However, I've now brought him up, here, twice as many times as he's commented. So, that's a little creepy.

2007-01-11 19:15:53
12.   Greg Brock
We can't all man up and watch Devine Design.
2007-01-11 19:16:35
13.   Greg Brock
Or Divine Design, for that matter.
2007-01-11 19:17:04
14.   Andrew Shimmin
I feel like Frank the time that B.J. and Hawkeye fight with each other as a birthday present for him.
2007-01-11 19:18:01
15.   trainwreck
He watches because of Kate Walsh. Which makes sense to me.
2007-01-11 19:19:32
16.   D4P
We can't all man up and watch Devine Design

Hey, I watch that with my wife...

Geez, another spelling mistake. I'm losing it.

2007-01-11 19:21:15
17.   Greg Brock
16 Wife, life partner, whatever. You're still the man, D4P.
2007-01-11 19:25:22
18.   Greg Brock
I've heard Ugly Betty is quite good, but I have yet to see it.
2007-01-11 20:02:16
19.   D4P
How about "wife partner"...?
2007-01-11 20:06:36
20.   trainwreck
I just saw a preview for Rear Window remake with teenagers. I think I am going to be sick.
2007-01-11 20:07:28
21.   trainwreck
It is called Disturbia.
2007-01-11 20:09:14
22.   D4P
Remakes are Dead to Me.

The worst is all the dumb "superhero" movies that come out every year. Movie-goers are sheep.

2007-01-11 20:10:54
23.   Greg Brock
20 There is only one true Miss Torso.
2007-01-11 20:11:07
24.   Bob Timmermann
2007-01-11 20:12:16
25.   D4P
Say it ain't so...
2007-01-11 20:13:07
26.   Greg Brock
Grace Kelly and Miss Torso...A deadly combination.
2007-01-11 20:16:02
27.   D4P
I should make a point to watch Hitchcock movies more often. I wish they were on TV as often as Bond.
2007-01-11 20:16:11
28.   Bob Timmermann
I thought "Rear Window" had Christopher Reeve and Daryl Hannah in it?
2007-01-11 20:17:09
29.   trainwreck
This one has Shia Lebouf and David Morse.
2007-01-11 20:19:27
30.   Greg Brock
David Morse will be a terrible Miss Lonleyhearts.
2007-01-11 20:19:54
31.   Greg Brock
Spelling is overrated.
2007-01-11 20:22:33
32.   D4P
So is speling.
2007-01-11 20:23:29
33.   Bob Timmermann
I believe Tori Spelling is appropriately rated.
2007-01-11 20:25:56
34.   D4P
What about Torii Hunter?
2007-01-11 20:33:58
35.   trainwreck
I would pick Karen too.
2007-01-11 20:48:21
36.   Greg Brock
Wow, Andy is actually quite a scumbag.
2007-01-11 20:50:59
37.   ToyCannon
Scrubs is currently and has always been my favorite.

Just came back from seeing Pan's Labyrinth (El Laberinto del Fauno). Disturbing but yet one of the best movies I've seen in quite sometime.

2007-01-11 20:51:57
38.   Andrew Shimmin
Yeah. The BBWAA isn't in charge of admissions to Cornell, apparently.
2007-01-11 20:54:35
39.   trainwreck
You are so lucky. One theater in the Bay Area is showing it and it is not near me.
2007-01-11 20:57:36
40.   Andrew Shimmin
Wow. It's almost worth it, just knowing what JoeyP is going to think of it. But that can't really be the end, can it?
2007-01-11 20:59:48
41.   Greg Brock
Oh boy. Andy is a dead man.
2007-01-11 21:02:16
42.   trainwreck
That is what happens when you call yourself Andy.
2007-01-11 21:07:20
43.   Greg Brock
Anne Veal, AKA "Egg" is a guest star on Grey's Anatomy.
2007-01-11 21:08:54
44.   D4P
Her? Is she funny or something?
2007-01-11 21:10:26
45.   trainwreck
I actually decided to turn on Grey's Anatomy, but I am listening to Nick Diaz rip on people with painted toenails. I think she has a disfigured back, so I guess she is not supposed to be funny.
2007-01-11 21:10:55
46.   Greg Brock
45 She's playing a gal with a severe spinal affliction. She's actually quite good, and rather un-Anne like. Very misanthropic and angry.

The problem with Anne is that she was never as ugly as Michael thought she was. She's a decent looking gal. Plus, she wanted to learn the Bluth's secular ways.

2007-01-11 21:16:58
47.   trainwreck
Clearly, I need to go to different hospitals when I have problems. I wish I would get treated by a gang of beautiful doctors.
2007-01-11 21:18:35
48.   D4P
According to "TV", all lawyers, doctors, and law enforcement personnel are beautiful/handsome.
2007-01-11 21:19:49
49.   Greg Brock
Nobody tunes in to watch ugly people.
2007-01-11 21:19:52
50.   D4P
And the worst part of it is that all the networks have to do is throw together a lawyer/doctor/law enforcement show with a cast of attractive people and people will watch it every time.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-01-11 21:21:50
51.   trainwreck
That is how I judge whether I will watch a season of the Real World.
2007-01-11 21:26:54
52.   D4P

Anyway, Mrs. D4P and I have started watching "Keeping Up Appearances" from the beginning. I had seen a handful of episodes over the years, but had never watched it intentionally.

It's a great show. Onslow cracks me up.

2007-01-11 21:29:47
53.   trainwreck
Bought it on DVD for my mom for Christmas. Poor Richard.
2007-01-11 21:31:09
54.   trainwreck
I was raised on a lot of English sitcoms.

Are You Being Served? holds a special place in my heart.

2007-01-11 21:33:01
55.   D4P
Poor Richard

Yeah, gotta feel sorry for Dickie

2007-01-11 21:34:20
56.   Greg Brock
Oh come on, people. Jeeves and Wooster.

Stephen Fry + Hugh Laurie = Awesomeness.

2007-01-11 21:42:44
57.   trainwreck
I knew them from the Blackadder series.
2007-01-11 21:58:39
58.   trainwreck
Apparently, all hot doctors have to make out with each other as well.
2007-01-11 21:59:57
59.   D4P
I sometimes wonder if all the exposure lawyers and doctors get on TV shows and movies has a positive impact on the amount of money the real lawyers and doctors are able to charge us for their services.
2007-01-11 22:03:23
60.   Andrew Shimmin
59- I'd guess the opposite. TV exposure makes the jobs more glamorous, enticing more people to enter the field, driving the price down. The board exams for each profession drive the price of their services up. Also, the fact that people are willing to pay lots of money to not die.
2007-01-11 22:03:51
61.   trainwreck
Same with drug dealers.
2007-01-11 22:18:05
62.   Bob Timmermann
But I though there was a decline in the number of people wanting to become doctors or at least a decline in the supply of doctors relative to the demand.
2007-01-11 22:21:11
63.   Andrew Shimmin
62- Yeah, but not because television made it seem too glamorous. There are lots of things that keep the price of medical care high, and lots or reasons not to go to med school. I'm just saying, television probably isn't one of them.
2007-01-11 22:22:11
64.   overkill94
Funniest line of the night surprisingly came from 30 Rock

Tracy Morgan: I'm gonna make you a mix tape. You like Phil Collins?
Alec Baldwin: I have two ears and a heart, don't I?

2007-01-11 22:24:45
65.   overkill94
Also, Scrubs has definitely jumped the shark with all these baby plotlines. Did Carla or Turk say anything remotely funny tonight? The janitor's "Girl from Ipanema" dance was maybe the only laugh out loud moment of the episode for me. Was there even more than 30 seconds of medical-related dialogue?
2007-01-11 22:30:27
66.   D4P
Amen. I haven't watched tonight's episode yet, but the baby plotlines suck. For the most part, marriages and babies are the kiss of death for sitcoms.

Carla is generally annoying. Everything has to be so dramatic. Who cares about her baby? Who cares about her post-partum depression? SCRUBS IS SUPPOSED TO BE FUNNY!

Cox and Jordan's babies were enough. They didn't need to add more.

2007-01-11 22:33:14
67.   Bob Timmermann
I liked "Scrubs", but I'm just a sheep.
2007-01-11 23:23:07
68.   Greg Brock
The new NBC/Universal horror channel actually sounds good. After years of hearing of upcoming horror channels, and reading about the garbage they would use to fill the slots, this channel actually sounds loaded with good stuff (Hitchcock Presents, Tales From The Crypt, the Universal monsters, etc.) Yay!

2007-01-11 23:35:07
69.   trainwreck
I am a horror movie fan and I have been waiting for these horror channels to come out.
2007-01-11 23:37:39
70.   Greg Brock
69 Yeah, but this one is the first proposed horror channel that doesn't sound like it sucks.
2007-01-11 23:39:26
71.   trainwreck
I loved Tayles From The Crypt, even the kids cartoon show.
2007-01-11 23:40:07
72.   trainwreck
I never actually knew what specific things were going to be on any of the channels. I just hope for some foreign horror.
2007-01-11 23:45:23
73.   Greg Brock
I don't know who's going to control the Argento films, or any of the Asian flicks. I think a competing channel has the Argento movies.
2007-01-11 23:58:05
74.   Greg Brock
By the by, I thought this was a fantastic Office episode. Actually, one of my favorites in a long while. Only problem? No Kevin and Creed.

But man, what a good episode.

2007-01-11 23:59:11
75.   trainwreck
I hope they stick to old Argento. Hopefully they show some Bava and other older films.
2007-01-12 00:39:28
76.   El Lay Dave
47 I encountered a young, hot, blonde doctor in an ER, twice. She treated my (young) daughter for a scratched cornea and guessed from my appearance that I was a fireman or a cop (I am an engineer - was it flattery or mercy?). A year later she remembered me when I came in with a puncture wound in a swollen knee. (Un?)Fortunately, she was not the ER doctor that treated me for epididymitis.
2007-01-12 09:23:41
77.   Jon Weisman
64 - At a minimum, it was the funniest non-Office line of the night. It cracked me up - but I thought it was a great Office episode too.

65/66 - There was an entire plot about medicine - Eliott's debate with Cox and J.D. over private practice and patient care.

I think Scrubs is showing its age a little bit, but I don't think it makes sense to prevent characters from growing. I wouldn't have gone the baby route with J.D., but it wouldn't have made sense for Turk and Carla to put off a baby. As for who cares about Carla's depression, well, I care about Carla, so I do. Scrubs has always had dramatic moments - always. Brendan Fraser, anyone?

I don't think the execution has been outstanding, but it's not the storylines that are at fault. We've just seen the characters' act a little too long, I think, and they're having to go farther and farther out for laughs. Stunting their growth, however, is not going to be a solution.

I still like the show, even if it's off its peak, which was high up there, and I do laugh.

2007-01-12 09:55:20
78.   D4P
Part of my problem with Carla's drama is that it seems somewhat of a racial stereotype to me.
2007-01-12 10:05:55
79.   Jon Weisman
78 - What are you talking about? Weren't Carla and Jordan relating to each other over it? Post-partum depression affecting only people of color - does that stereotype even exist?
2007-01-12 10:10:56
80.   D4P
I'm not referring specifically to post-partum, but rather all of the drama that has accompanied the marriage, efforts to get pregnant, pregnancy, aftermath, etc., and Carla's response to it.

For that matter, both Carla and Turk are stereotypes in a lot of ways. At least, that's my opinion. You may disagree...

2007-01-12 10:27:49
81.   Jon Weisman
I'm absoutely mystified by both those paragraphs. I've never seen any of what you described associated with race, and in fact, if those discussions weren't such a common part of the white person's experience, the daytime talkshow market, from the Today Show through The View and Oprah, would not be what it is today.

And Carla and Turk are stereotypes? My jaw is dropping. How exactly is the goofy doctor and the sharp but sensitive nurse a stereotype (at least in any negative sense)? It's not as if they aren't part of their given races, but they are such individuals, so well-defined and so idiosyncratic - I just don't get it.

2007-01-12 10:36:04
82.   CanuckDodger
Scrubs is a good show that used to be a GREAT show almost every episode. As conscious as I am of the decline, it seems like I am not even enjoying the quality that is still there. Zach Braff has already said he is not staying with the show beyond this season, so I am praying that the producers and the network will just let Scrubs die.
2007-01-12 10:47:45
83.   Linkmeister
So what happened to "Day Break?" It was heavily promoted as the replacement for "Lost" while the latter was on its midwinter break, and then it disappeared (or at least I haven't seen it advertised at all on ABC).

I'm torn about the return of "Lost;" I've kinda enjoyed not feeling like I have to spend an hour watching television on Wednesday nights.

2007-01-12 10:51:51
84.   Jon Weisman
82 - There's basically no chance of it returning. Contracts, as you mention, are up. It's not even performing at an Office level ratings-wise. They're not grooming any kind of replacement for Braff, and bringing in a new lead cold would be risky - since one assumes Braff is a reason many people watch.

Assuming NBC keeps the comedy block on Thursday, it is pretty set at 8 p.m. with Earl and Office. 30 Rock has probably earned a second season. The idea that NBC is going to go out of its way to keep Scrubs on the air, when it has treated the show as a second-class citizen even at its height, seems very unlikely. More likely, they'll put a new comedy there.

Of course, NBC could give up on the comedy block altogether, and follow through on their plan to mostly put unscripted fare at 8 p.m.

2007-01-12 10:52:17
85.   Bob Timmermann
"Day Break" has been broken. Taye Diggs can finally go to sleep.
2007-01-12 10:52:55
86.   Jon Weisman
Day Break is gone, as predicted.
2007-01-12 10:54:27
87.   Bob Timmermann
On another message board I visit (sorry Jon, there's another place I talk about TV, I didn't mean to betray you), several women posted about how much they enjoyed "Scrubs" last night because the depiction of postpartum depression seemed to closely match what they had gone through.
2007-01-12 11:02:16
88.   Linkmeister
85, 86 Thanks. It was a weird premise (although I suppose "24" seemed like a strange one too when pitched.
2007-01-12 12:16:45
89.   D4P

Let me know if this is upsetting you, and I'll stop.

Just off the top of my head (I'd have more if I re-watched every episode):

1. The shizzles, nizzles, dizzles, etc.
2. Good dancer
3. Good at basketball (though, admittedly, got dunked on by Lonnie)
4. All the "Wassup" kinda lingo
5. Horny (while white characters are horny too, minority horniness is usually portrayed differently in my opinion)
6. Religious (though not in the kind of way that really directs one's life (for example, not having sex before marriage because you think it is "wrong"), but rather in a way that makes one like gospel choirs and that makes one conveniently remember around Christmas time that Christmas should mean "something more" and that gives one the faith necessary to follow the bright light in the sky to find the pregnant girl under the tree. In my view, "white" religion is typically portrayed by the media in a way that is very different from "black" or minority religion. White religion is people like the Veals, who burn secular records, get pre-engaged, and don't kiss before marriage. White religion is televangelists and greedy hypocrites who care more about money and power than they do about God or people. White religion is overzealous and in your face, either trying to convert you or condemn your for your sins and unwillingness to repent. White religion makes people uncomfortable. Black religion, on the other hand, is cutesy. It's about gospel choirs and charismatic preachers who talk like Jesse Jackson reading Dr. Seuss or who say stuff like "Can I get an a-mennnnnnn-uh". Black religion is about people who wear colorful, Southern garb to church. Black religion seems more cultural than metaphysical. At one level, it may seem that there is more respect (or at least, less irreverence) for black religion. But I find the whole thing very patronizing)

1. The whole "Latina from the block" thing that seems to have started (??? I'm no expert) with Rosie Perez' character in "White Me Can't Jump"
2. The associated finger snaps, "No you di'int" and attitude copping
3. I still maintain the drama belongs on this list

2007-01-12 12:23:47
90.   overkill94
77 The Brendan Fraser plotlines worked because not only did they continue to be funny, but when they turned serious they really tugged at your heart strings. On the other hand, I don't really care about Carla's PPD and there's absolutely no humor in it.

It just seems that they've abandoned their formula way too much. Last night (if I remember correctly) there was no conflict between JD and the janitor, no verbal sparring between JD and Dr. Cox, no college buddy moments between JD and Turk, and pretty weak "JD tangent" sequences. It's not that I don't enjoy when the plot is advanced, I just wish they wouldn't focus so much on the plot elements while abandoning the comedy.

2007-01-12 12:28:06
91.   overkill94
89 While you're right about those stereotypes, I think most if not all of them are done for comedic purposes rather than to put anyone down. JD has most of the same characteristics and the ones that he doesn't have (good dancer and good at basketball) are traits he wishes he had.

Plus, I think you're taking the religion thing way too far considering the only time it really came up was the episode you're referencing withe the pregnant teenager. Aside from that it has mostly been Turk comedically talking to God about his complaints.

2007-01-12 12:31:05
92.   D4P
The Brendan Fraser character was one of my least favorite, though I did appreciate Cox's performance after he died.

I wonder if "focusing on the plot elements" and moving people forward in their lives is in anticipation of the show ending. Writers seem compelled (or do you prefer "compeled"?) to make big changes at the end of a series, including marriages, babies, people moving to different places, deaths, etc.

2007-01-12 12:34:02
93.   D4P
While you're right about those stereotypes, I think most if not all of them are done for comedic purposes rather than to put anyone down

I agree.

Regarding religion, I wasn't confining myself to Scrubs, but I do feel like some of the stereotypical religious elements have shown up there. IIRC, Dr. Cox's sister (a white Christian) was portrayed as somewhat of a pariah. Even though the episode ended happily, for most of it Dr. Cox supposedly wanted nothing to do with her because of her faith. But, IIRC, that kind of issue never came up between Cox and Turk...

2007-01-12 12:44:40
94.   D4P
An additional thought:

It seems more acceptable to mock/ridicule/satire white people for their faith than non-white people. I suspect writers fear accusations of racism. As a result, they seemingly treat black religion with more respect. But in so doing, they seem to reduce black religion into something almost trivial and simple-minded, with more style and symbolism than substance and meaning.

2007-01-12 12:55:55
95.   overkill94
93 Dr. Cox's sister was a pretty big Bible-thumper as opposed to Turk who rarely brings religion up (and never in front of Dr. Cox IIRC). Plus, they revealed the real reason at the end of the episode why he didn't like seeing her, so the point is moot anyway; the born-again Christian thing was just the easiest thing for him to hold against her.
2007-01-12 12:56:13
96.   Jon Weisman
89 - Well, your Carla list is pretty feeble. Even if I were to grant you 1), several on the show do 2), and as for 3) the thing that got us off on this tangent, that is just still so strange to me, I don't know what else to say. When, again, did post-partum depression become a racial thing?

Your Turk list is longer, but what it discounts is how many things Turk does that are not according to stereotype. In fact, wasn't there a whole plotline in one episode about how white Turk was? Half of your list, 1, 4 and 5, applies to J.D. just as much as Turk. J.D likes the lingo and he is horny. Similarly, there are things Turk does that are stereotypically white.

Clearly, Turk and J.D. love both their own backgrounds and other backgrounds, and they proudly take on characteristics of both.

I mean, I don't know where this discussion between us is going - and trust me, it's nothing personal - but I just don't see the value in focusing on the ways these characters are stereotypes. You'd be hard-pressed to find any people in the world that don't have a handful of characteristics associated with their race, no matter how unstereotypical they are.

In 80, you said they were stereotypes in a lot of ways. Is what you've described really "a lot", in the context of their entire characters and in the world of the show?

2007-01-12 12:58:12
97.   overkill94
92 I agree that the end of the series syndrome may be in effect here, which is what makes me appreciate Seinfeld that much more. Not only did they never let the plot get in the way of comedy, they continued being the same self-centered bachelors/bachelorettes right up to the end. Plus, I think the last season was the best overall; it may not be the popular opinion, but I stand by it wholeheartedly.
2007-01-12 12:58:19
98.   Jon Weisman
92 - That you didn't like the Brendan Fraser character shows me that we are just on opposite ends of the spectrum in terms of what we're looking for or what we're getting out of Scrubs.
2007-01-12 12:59:26
99.   Jon Weisman
97 - Last season of Seinfeld as the best? Yeah, you don't hear that a lot.
2007-01-12 13:05:30
100.   Jon Weisman
96 - I think I could have made my point in a lot fewer words by saying, I don't think the stereotypical aspects of Turk and Carla define who they are, and that's what's important.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-01-12 13:06:16
101.   overkill94
98 I agree, Fraser was easily one of my top-5 minor characters on the show. He played the comedic and dramatic sides equally well and left me truly sad when he was gone.

99 I know, most people point to the 4th or 6th seasons, but for pure comedic value I feel the 9th season is the best. Sure it was much more wacky and a bit less observational, but regardless, most of my favorite episodes are there. It should be noted that I didn't watch the show while it was aired, so I have the advantage (curse?) of evaluating each episode on its own merits and not how they affected me when they first came out.

2007-01-12 13:14:32
102.   D4P
Dr. Cox's sister was a pretty big Bible-thumper as opposed to Turk who rarely brings religion up

That's consistent with what I'm saying. White Christians are portrayed as Bible-thumpers; black Christians aren't. (Some exceptions may apply). Yes, like I said, the episode ended with Cox saying that her faith wasn't what bothered him, but most of the episode focused on her Bible-thumping Christianity and his aversion to it.

Regarding JD's stereotypically "black": behavior: isn't this mostly (if not solely) a result of him copying C-Bear...?

The Carla list looks short, but the Latina from the block thing has larger ramifications than simply one point on a bulleted list.

I, too, appreciated the ending of Seinfeld. With the obvious exception of the year in prison, none of them moved, none of them had major relationship-status changes, they didn't get new jobs somewhere else, etc., they just stayed who they were. For whatever reason, it takes guts for writers to do that. There seems to be a belief that viewers want resolution at the end of a series, where resolution means change.

It would take guts for the writers of Scrubs to end the show (assuming they have time to plan out the ending, unlike "The Wonder Years", for example) with everyone still working at the hospital, single people still single, JD and Elliot not getting back together, etc., i.e., no major changes.

2007-01-12 13:18:52
103.   D4P
Fraser was another in a long line of family members I haven't liked.

1. Carla's brother
2. JD's brother
3. JD's father
4. Turk's brother
5. Jordan's brother

1. Surprisingly, Jordan's sister

Relatively indifferent:
1. Elliot's parents

(Am I forgetting any...?)

BTW: I wonder if Elliot's brother "Barry" will ever make an appearance...

2007-01-12 13:24:01
104.   overkill94
102 You can see Cox's sister as a stereotype or just see her as another character on the show that has exaggerated characteristics. I choose the latter.

The main reason I don't see anything stereotypical about Turk and Carla is that the hip-hop culture is a pretty common act for younger people to follow these days, so even when JD is saying things like "dizzle" it doesn't seem strange because it's common slang these days for blacks and whites.

The bottom line is that you can find stereotypes in anyone you encounter, but as long as those traits don't define the person then there's no harm done. I see Turk as a career-oriented guy with immature tendencies who stands up for things he believes in. I see Carla as a hard-working, sassy straight-shooter that doesn't put up with anyone's BS. Do either of those people sound like stereotypes? If Turk was a drug-dealing misogynist and Carla was a Welfare-collecting mother of seven then I think you would have a point.

2007-01-12 13:26:33
105.   overkill94
103 Interesting, I think I would go:

1. Carla's mother
2. Turk's brother
3. Jordan's sister

1. JD's brother
2. JD's dad

1. Carla's brother
2. Elliot's parents

2007-01-12 13:30:28
106.   Jon Weisman
102 - I don't think it takes guts to do resolution or not to do resolution.

As for the finale of Seinfeld, that was the single-worst episode in the series - mainly for the reasons you'd be the first to point out. It wasn't funny. But I disagree with the notion that there was no resolution. They took the characters and put them in jail - that's the opposite of leaving them in status quo. (Which, if you want, was a resolution that took guts.) And, Elaine declared that she was in love with Jerry.

2007-01-12 13:32:05
107.   Jon Weisman
104 - I agree.
2007-01-12 13:34:17
108.   overkill94
106 I agree the finale was pretty weak, it seemed that they were more focused on stuffing all the old characters they could find into the episode to make people feel sentimental.

Plus, Elaine never actually said she was still in love with Jerry, she got cut off before she could finish. I saw that as a tongue-in-cheek way of making fun of other shows for doing that same thing.

2007-01-12 13:34:44
109.   D4P
1. Carla's mother

I can't remember much about her.

They took the characters and put them in jail - that's the opposite of leaving them in status quo

On some level, yes, but they were only in jail for a year, after which as far as we know they resumed their normal lives.

I don't think it inherently takes guts to not do resolution; I think it takes guts not to do resolution in the current environment where resolution seems to be the expectation, and where no resolution seems like a significant deviation from what is expected.

But I'll defer to the writer on this one...

2007-01-12 13:35:56
110.   D4P
And to add to the disagreement, I liked the finale of Seinfeld...I especially liked Jerry's stand-up routine in front of his inmates.
2007-01-12 13:44:34
111.   overkill94
In fact, going back and watching the episode, the only revelations are that George cheated in the contest and Elaine says "Jerry, I've always l-". Later on she claims she was about to say "I've always loved you-nited airlines".

While that episode in general wasn't very funny, I love how their last act of defiance is to laugh at a fat guy getting robbed and then act so non-chalant while they're on trial. Although putting them in jail is a physical resolution, there was no sudden emotional growth.

2007-01-12 13:48:38
112.   overkill94
110 "You would think that the weight-lifting and sodomy was enough"

"How about you, what are you in for?"
- "Grand theft auto"
"Grand theft auto, don't steal any of my jokes"
- "You suck! I'm gonna cut you!"
"Hey, I don't come down to where you work and knock the license plate out of your hand"

2007-01-12 13:48:56
113.   Jon Weisman
109 - "On some level, yes, but they were only in jail for a year, after which as far as we know they resumed their normal lives."

Well, shoot, now you're just cheating. We're talking about what the show did, and what it did was literally slam the door on them. By bringing in so many characters from seasons past, it tied up tons of loose ends. A year later, yes, they might resume their nomal lives, but tou could just as easily speculate that Elaine and Jerry end up together.

I just think "guts" is the wrong word. It's just a choice. If you only resolve because you're afraid not to, that's one thing, but I think most TV writers, given the chance to have a wrapup, choose to do so.

Of course, there are exceptions. David Chase, I expect, is going to be one with Sopranos. But again, if he does resolve, I don't think that will make him any less courageous.

2007-01-12 13:51:47
114.   Jon Weisman
111 - "sudden emotional growth" is not a criterion. The kind of resolution I'm talking about is the kind that is the culmination of things, not something sudden.

Trust me, there won't be any sudden emotional growth at the end of Scrubs. That whole show has been about emotional growth its entire journey.

2007-01-12 13:59:05
115.   overkill94
I think we're delving too much into a single episode that had pretty much no previous events that led up to it. As a contrast, in their last couple seasons Friends had Chandler and Monica get a child, Ross and Rachel have a child (and get married again? i haven't seen all the later episodes), Phoebe get married to someone. Okay, I'm not the best one to talk about that show, but it seemed that every character had something fantastic happen to them at the end.
2007-01-12 14:00:49
116.   overkill94
114 I just think that everyone having a baby is a cop-out way to get people to be emotionally invested in the last season of a show. Add to that the fact that they're focusing less on making the show funny and you can color me disappointed.
2007-01-12 14:19:26
117.   Jon Weisman
116 - I don't think they're copping out. I think it's just something they wanted to do. I don't know why they wanted to do it with J.D.

I don't think their focusing less on making the show funny, either. I think they're just finding it a harder and harder challenge. These characters, while great, are also cartoons to an extent - and look at the trouble the Simpsons has had in remaining funny. That show has been off its game for roughly 10 years.

I'm not arguing that the show isn't as funny as it used to be. I just think you guys are overthinking the reasons - you make it sound like they're choosing not to be funny. It's more like this: Comedy is hard.

My favorite show right now is The Office. It's the hands-down funniest show on TV right now. But I'm amazed each week - each week - that it is as funny as the previous week, and if it's this funny three years from now, I'll be absolutely stunned. No matter what path it takes.

Although Seinfeld's last season was my least favorite, it was absolutely remarkable in how funny it was until the end.

2007-01-12 14:19:55
118.   D4P
One thing that has been missing from this season of Scrubs is the "Jordan" character. Not only is she a good character by herself, but her relationship with Perry is, come to think of it, one of my favorite aspects of the show.
2007-01-12 14:34:53
119.   overkill94
I realize that comedy is hard, which is evident by the depressing paucity of funny comedies on TV these days, but I just think it's strange that all five previous seasons were consistently funny and then once they introducing all these extra plot elements the comedy factor is diminished. Basically, it's hard for me to believe that they lost "it" that quickly.
2007-01-12 14:37:40
120.   D4P
Is 120 a post record for Screen Jam...?
2007-01-12 14:46:35
121.   Jon Weisman
119 - I don't think the difference between this season and the last is that dramatic. Overall, I enjoyed last night's episode, even if it wasn't all that good by Scrubs standards, so what can I tell you?

120 - I think so.

2007-01-12 14:50:33
122.   overkill94
121 Don't get me wrong, Scrubs at 80% is better than most shows at 100%, but it's still a bit disappointing when one of your favorite shows isn't churning out the same quality of material that it has in the past.
2007-01-12 15:35:22
123.   Jon Weisman
122 - I agree. I really do. I can remember when the show blew me away, and it doesn't do that now.
2007-01-12 15:46:59
124.   Greg Brock
Yes, yes. Scrubs.


2007-01-12 15:57:46
125.   Jon Weisman
124 - High noon, baby :)
2007-01-12 17:49:50
126.   Bob Timmermann
She made a vow while at Dunder-Mifflin
Vowed it would her life or his kin and
She's not afraid of death, but O
But what would do if Shrute left her?

Do not forsake him O my Angela!
You made that promise as to HR!
Do not forsake him O my Angela!
Although your steamin', she can't be dreamin'
Until she shoots Andy Bernard dead...

2007-01-12 20:52:59
127.   Andrew Shimmin
Schrute. He's one of your'n, not one of mine'n.
2007-01-12 21:28:57
128.   Greg Brock
I just re-watched the episode, and I have to say that Stanley's sale with Ryan is twice as funny the second time. Big ups to Stanley, and the defeated look of Ryan.
2007-01-12 22:37:00
129.   Andrew Shimmin
For Bob,

The essence of According to Jim's six years of laughter and tears (both of which, in the context, being metaphorical), crammed in to 90 seconds:

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